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From	Message
changeling 07-Jan-13, 20:30	stinky In many cases of abortion I would guess the alternative would be a much higher cost to public money. Is that all it really comes down to, the money?
anomalocaris 07-Jan-13, 20:33	Change If a person is religiously against abortion should they be forced to pay for it? I think thats a little deeper than just about the money. Dont you?
changeling 07-Jan-13, 21:23	They don't have to pay for their own. This is not a religious issue but a social one in terms of government (The US is a secular nation). Belief over practicality is one of the problems. The practicality of not allowing abortions (for whatever reason) does not add up in terms of money the public purse must consider. There is far too much emphasis from (mainly) the right side of politics on what everyone has to pay in terms of social security, unemployment payments etc. to the less advantaged in our societies (even here), but when it comes to an actual position that can alleviate some of these problems there is a resounding no! No we will not pay for your abortion and no we will not help you financially to look after a child either. Both ways? I don't know what a legal abortion costs in the US, perhaps hundreds of dollars, but the cost to the taxpayers of stopping them is incalculable over the long term. We have to remember at some stage that it is the bean counters that will have they way sooner or later, and to them 'we' are only numbers and dollars and cents. It is all very well to jump on the loose morals bandwagon and claim these 'women' have other means to prevent unwanted pregnancies (which is done often within these threads even when the subject of abortion rears its ugly head). But we all know that life is simply that, it has never been any different, males and females will mate regardless of religious attitudes or social norms. Many at far too young an age in my opinion. I was young once, my girlfriend became pregnant, we married, we divorced. It all starts over again every time. I was lucky in respect of having the means (jobs) to pay for my youthful stupidity. Many don't and that becomes a far bigger cost to the bean-counters and the public purse. Would you rather pay a few cents to stop the cost to society later, or pay hundreds if not thousands overall. Yes the money counts. You must pay taxes, they go towards many things including paying for weapons of mass destruction for your armed forces. I don't hear too much outcry over that from the religiously inclined.
musket33r 07-Jan-13, 22:05	stinky People are religiously against conflict yet still pay for defence. If people were allowed to choose where their tax dollars went, you'd see state of the art healthcare and education systems with crumbling institutions everywhere else. Change is right on this one. It's economic sense to pay for an abortion rather than pay for a kid, pay for an unemployed young mother who has to look after her kid and give them both a house.
chaz- 08-Jan-13, 08:29	Softy .... ... and you post another lame lambaste ... my question was an honest one ... I'm still curious. Surely, the original point can be easily defended ... or not.
softaire 08-Jan-13, 08:58	chaz It may have been an "honest" question. Your post offered no discussion about the topic and previous post. Instead of contributing your ideas and thoughts, you once again ask a question. That was my statement. You can call it a lambast if you like. (it may be lame) But it is my complaint that you very rarely contribute anything... that's all.
jerry64 08-Jan-13, 09:08	@softaire Half the population does not contribute, rather leech off everyone else, and then hide behind this "we are a democracy"! We MUST do want the masses want. But it's like children and a teacher. I guarantee by a 15 to 1 vote everytime, the classroom would vote to have recess all day everyday.
softaire 08-Jan-13, 09:52	Jerry You need to get over it... we have passed the tipping point. People now expect the government to give them money and things. They expect all the legislation to provide that they get something... preferably for free, paid for by the "rich". They expect extended unemployment money so they do not stress about getting a job. They expect welfare and food stamp money to allow them to buy lap dances, booze, cigarettes and gambling at the casinos. They expect that they have a right to privacy in the bedroom but that gun owners do not have a right to the privacy of their names and addresses for owning a gun. They expect free medical care and education. They expect that the government should ensure them a safe, secure, healthy and happy life.
tat3225 08-Jan-13, 10:03	"They expect welfare and food stamp money to allow them to buy lap dances, booze, cigarettes and gambling at the casinos." TRUE. Bam!: www.nypost.com
jerry64 08-Jan-13, 10:05	softaire Isn't it sad. I really want to help them understand, but know that offer will only come across as arrogant. Nobody wants to earn anything or do anything the hard way. There is no sense of appreciating or reward for a job well done. Instead, it's "lets penalize those that are happy, let's restrict their freedoms, lets take from them, because they don't deserve it, and if they did, then we should all have it." I really don't think they will ever understand until they put in an honest day and realize the value of freedom and the price we pay for it.
chaz- 08-Jan-13, 15:51	Softy .... ... are you saying that I should not ask questions? ... or that I should only ask questions when I have an opinion about the subject? I don't understand why you badger me on this point over and over. And you continue your lambasting ... is that just for fun?
softaire 08-Jan-13, 16:01	chaz You may ask all the questions you like, especially when you don't have an opinion about the subject. That's exactly what I have saying... you don't have an opinion, nor any thoughts, about things so you ask questions. I just happen to think it would be a little more interesting if you did have some thoughts and opinions, and was willing to share them. So, question away!
chaz- 08-Jan-13, 20:37	Softy .... ... I don't ask questions to satisfy your quest for how folks need to post. If I'm forming an opinion, I'd like to to find out more information instead of just spewing preconceptions ... hence the questions. I guess I just don't fully appreciate how much you like to play games with people.
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