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Ongoing Civil war
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dmaestro 28-Oct-18, 10:00 |
 Ongoing Civil warI posted this elsewhere but I am curious about your response to concerns abbot the ongoing war in America. |
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dmeastro . . . Christians have been praying for the tide to turn - especially during the last 8 years. Those prayers were miraculously answered in 2016. youtu.be |
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John 9:31 Let us all do a thought experiment shall we? On a piece of paper make the following list. Loving Patient Kind Thoughtful Honest Loyal Merciful Peaceful Humble ------------------------------------------- Spiteful Vain Dishonest Un-loyal Proud Vengeful Haughty Selfish Greedy Now ask yourselves which qualities does Donald J Trump have the most of. And how does that match up to what the Bible says? If Trump had not claimed to be a brother then I would not bother with such a comparison . As it is written in 1 Corinthians 5:12 What business of mine is it to judge those outside the church. Should you not Judge those inside? - Paul of Tarsus www.biblehub.com And I will say. By his fruit you should have recognized him!!! Love is the fulfillment of the law! If you have not love you are nothing. Therefore are you a child of the world? Or of God? |
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“None is righteous, no, not one; 11 no one understands; no one seeks for God. 12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.” 13 “Their throat is an open grave; they use their tongues to deceive.” “The venom of asps is under their lips.” 14 “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.” 15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood; 16 in their paths are ruin and misery, 17 and the way of peace they have not known.” 18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.” |
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apatzer . . . It is no coincidence, incidentally, that the founding fathers made it the cornerstone of our Constitution, I submit. Satan has been attacking our Biblical heritage from 1776. All of those wonderful Scriptures and wonderful or despicable traits used to be taught in our homes and schools. We have failed miserably to uphold them. Trump IS trying to do the right thing. But he needs our help. He's asked for it. That has not been the case since when . . .? Would the Communists Democrats have done better? More to the point, seeing how far America has deviated from our early foundation, how would you proceed. In a manner which makes sense in our modern society? |
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Thank you IHS. A healthy debate is always good and as Iron sharpens Iron so does one man sharpen another. So first let me thank you for sharpening me brother. I'll take the queries in order.. so the first thing you mentioned was " God Governs in the Affairs of Men" and asked me to think about how does God do this? Before we can ask ourselves how. We must clearly define what that statement means. Let us first consult the standard definitions attributed by man to these words. As Jesus told Nicodemus " I speak to you of earthly things and yet you don't understand? How much more so for spiritual things?" End quote Then we will get to the spiritual meaning. So let us first define the three most important words in that verse. 1. Govern 2. Affiars 3. Men 1. Govern gov·ern [ˈɡəvərn] VERB governs (third person present) conduct the policy, actions, and affairs of (a state, organization, or people). "he was incapable of governing the country" synonyms: rule · [more] control, influence, or regulate (a person, action, or course of events). "the future of Jamaica will be governed by geography not history" (govern oneself) conduct oneself, especially with regard to controlling one's emotions. "men would give in to passion and become unable to govern themselves" synonyms: control · [more] grammar (of a word) require that (another word or group of words) be in a particular case. "the Latin preposition “cum” governs nouns in the ablative" 2. Affairs af·fair [əˈfer] NOUN affairs (plural noun) an event or sequence of events of a specified kind or that has previously been referred to. "the board admitted responsibility for the affair" · [more] synonyms: event · [more] a matter that is a particular person's concern or responsibility. "what you do in your spare time is your affair" (affairs) matters of public interest and importance. "commissions were created to advise on foreign affairs" a love affair. "his wife is having an affair" synonyms: relationship · [more] informal an object of a particular type. 3.Men man [man] NOUN an adult human male. "a small man with mischievous eyes" · [more] synonyms: male · [more] a human being of either sex; a person. "God cares for all races and all men" synonyms: human being · [more] informal (the Man) a group or person in a position of authority over others, such as a corporate employer or the police. "it was a vicarious way of powerless people being able to stick it to the Man" a figure or token used in playing a board game. VERB (of personnel) work at, run, or operate (a place or piece of equipment) or defend (a fortification). "the firemen manned the pumps and fought the blaze" synonyms: staff · crew · [more] archaic fortify the spirits or courage of. "he manned himself with dauntless air" I would like to know what you think IHS. You said that God usually works through Godly men. So I ask you this. ... If Paul said none are righteous no not even one. And Jesus said.... "Why do you call me good? no man is good. only God is good alone " Then who are the Godly men you refer to? I've got to get mack to work. Thank you sir for this opportunity. Take care... Respectfully yours, Robert |
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Washington D C Having established that then your trying to use the authority of the Scriptures to bear on that Government IS NOT going to work. You seem to have a great problem making a DISTINCTION between our Government and a church. Why is that? Do you understand what the First Amendment means when it prohibits "an establishment of religion"? This is key to this discussion IMO. |
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Would I be correct in inferring from your statements. That somehow you think our leaders are apointed and directed by God. Yet scripture has no authority nor should it be applied to thier actions? Give to ceasar what is Ceasars, but give to God what is Gods. Separation of church and state is very important and we need that because of the corruption of man. We abuse scripture for and in favor of our own traditions. Also I am not trying to make anything work or not work. I am simply stating the truth. We can not call ourselves Christians and put our Government before Christ. As Christ has said " anyone who loves father , mother sister or brother more than me. Is not worthy of me" How much more so for Government? Do you see the problem here? |
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Kingdom of God That is what this statement is referring to . . . Give to ceasar what is Ceasars, but give to God what is Gods. << Separation of church and state is very important and we need that because of the corruption of man. We abuse scripture for and in favor of our own traditions. >> The way you are using this "separation" statement tells me plainly you do not know how or why it is being used to silence the Church today! "Myth Bused: 'Separation of Church and State'" The American church has a problem. It’s one part fear, one part confusion and one part apathy. Pastors, priests and rabbis have long swallowed the false notion that all things religious and all things political are somehow mutually exclusive – that never the twain shall meet. Leading up to Ronald Reagan’s landslide presidential victory in 1980, Rev. Jerry Falwell, the founder of Liberty University, captured the crux of the church’s apathy problem. “I’m being accused of being controversial and political,” he said. “I’m not political. But moral issues that become political, I still fight. It isn’t my fault that they’ve made these moral issues political. But because they have doesn’t stop the preachers of the Gospel from addressing them. …” “What then is wrong?” he continued. “I say the problem, first of all, is in the pulpits of America. We preachers must take the blame. For too long we have fearfully stood back and failed to address the issues that are corrupting the republic. I repeat Proverbs 14:34: ‘Righteousness exalteth a nation.’ Not military might, though that’s important. Not financial resources, though that has been the enjoyment of this nation above all nations in the last 200 years. But spiritual power is the backbone, the strength, of a nation.” Indeed, it is not just within the church’s purview, but it is the church’s duty to insert itself into state matters relating to morality, public policy and culture at large. Contrary to popular opinion, the words “separation of church and state” are found nowhere in the U.S. Constitution. Yet many are misled into believing they are. So why the confusion? It’s been intentionally fomented. It’s the byproduct of a decades-long religious cleansing campaign. The First Amendment’s “Establishment Clause,” a mere 10 words, is the primary tool secular separatists misuse and abuse to “fundamentally transform” America to reflect their own anti-Christian self-image. Yet these words remain abundantly clear in both scope and meaning. The Establishment Clause states merely: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. …” That’s it. And the founders meant exactly what they said: “Congress,” as in the United States Congress, “shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion.” In a letter to Benjamin Rush, a fellow-signer of the Declaration of Independence, Thomas Jefferson, often touted by the left as the great church-state separationist, spelled out exactly what this meant then, and what it means today. The First Amendment’s Establishment Clause was simply intended to restrict Congress from affirmatively “establishing,” through federal legislation, a national Christian denomination (similar to the Anglican Church of England). As Jefferson put it: “[T]he clause of the Constitution” covering “freedom of religion” was intended to necessarily preclude “an establishment of a particular form of Christianity through the United States.” The individual states, however, faced no such restriction. In fact, until as late as 1877, and after religious free exercise became absolute with passage of the 14th Amendment, most states did have an official state form of Christianity. Massachusetts, for example, sanctioned the Congregational Church until 1833. Even so, today’s anti-Christian ruling class insists on revising history. The ACLU’s own promotional materials, for example, overtly advocate unconstitutional religious discrimination: “The message of the Establishment Clause [to the U.S. Constitution] is that religious activities must be treated differently from other activities to ensure against governmental support for religion,” they claim. This is abject nonsense. It’s unconstitutional viewpoint discrimination – a twisted misrepresentation of the First Amendment. Secular-“progressivism” depends upon deception as much as it relies upon revisionism. Yes, “separation” applies, but only insofar as it requires the state to remain separate from the church. That is to say, that government may not interfere with the free exercise of either speech or religion. For decades, hard-left anti-theist groups like the ACLU, People for the American Way (PFAW) and Barry Lynn’s Americans United (AU) have employed a cynical disinformation scheme intended to intimidate clergy into silence on issues of morality, culture and Christian civic involvement – issues that, as Falwell noted, are not political so much as they have been politicized; issues that are inherently “religious.” AU, for instance, annually sends tens-of-thousands of misleading letters to churches across the nation warning pastors, priests and rabbis that, “If the IRS determines that your house of worship has engaged in unlawful intervention, it can revoke the institution’s tax-exempt status.” That’s a lie. In reality, there is no legal mechanism whatsoever for the Internal Revenue Service to take away a church’s tax exemption. Churches are inherently tax-exempt, or, better still, “tax immune,” simply by virtue of being a church. Churches do not need permission from the IRS, nor can the IRS revoke a church’s tax immunity. Since 1934, when the lobbying restriction was added to the Internal Revenue Code, not a single church has ever lost its tax-exempt status. Since 1954, when the political endorsement/opposition prohibition was added, only one church has ever lost its IRS letter ruling, but even that church did not lose its tax-exempt status. The case involved the Church at Pierce Creek in New York, which placed full-page ads in USA Today and the Washington Times opposing then-Gov. Bill Clinton for president. The ads were sponsored by the church, and donations were solicited. The IRS revoked the church’s letter ruling, but not its tax-exempt status. The church sued, and the court noted that churches are tax-exempt without an IRS letter ruling. It ruled that “because of the unique treatment churches receive under the Internal Revenue Code, the impact of the revocation is likely to be more symbolic than substantial.” Not even this church lost its tax-exempt status, and not one donor was affected by this incident. As Mat Staver, founder of Liberty Counsel has observed, “Pastors can preach on biblical, moral and social issues, such as natural marriage and abortion, can urge the congregation to register and vote, can overview the positions of the candidates, and may personally endorse candidates. Churches may distribute nonpartisan voter guides, register voters, provide transportation to the polls, hold candidate forums, and introduce visiting candidates.” Since 2008, the Christian legal organization Alliance Defending Freedom has spearheaded a First Amendment exercise called “Pulpit Freedom Sunday.” Since then, thousands of pastors across America have boldly exercised their guaranteed constitutional rights by addressing “political” issues from the pulpit. This has included directly endorsing candidates. These pastors have dared the IRS to come after them, and, not surprisingly, the IRS has balked. Pastors, this election season follow the lead of Christ. Speak moral/political truths, in love, fearlessly. Remain undaunted by the threat of government intervention or punitive action by the state. And encourage your congregation to vote for candidates who sincerely reflect, in both word and deed, a biblical worldview and biblical principles. Be “salt and light.” Because Christ didn’t give us an option to do otherwise. illinoisfamily.org Am I a little irritated? $#&# right I am. Tired of church members not educating themselves enough on the issues to speak to the Devils running/ ruining our country today! |
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With all due respect unless we take this one topic at a time. This conversation will go nowhere fast. We have not even addressed your very first question yet. Was there something about my post that defined the terms that bothered you? As for Giving to Ceasar what is Ceasars. It is found in Matthew 22. Paying the Imperial Tax to Caesar 15Then the Pharisees went out and laid plans to trap him in his words. 16They sent their disciples to him along with the Herodians. “Teacher,” they said, “we know that you are a man of integrity and that you teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. You aren’t swayed by others, because you pay no attention to who they are. 17Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay the imperial tax a to Caesar or not?” 18But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, “You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? 19Show me the coin used for paying the tax.” They brought him a denarius, 20and he asked them, “Whose image is this? And whose inscription?” 21“Caesar’s,” they replied. Then he said to them, “So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.” 22When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away. Pay close attention to 15-17. As well as "You pay no attention to who they are" The Pharasiees had thier disciples. Jesus had his disciples. Jesus had said that the Pharasiees do the will of thier father the Devil and when they find a single convert they make them twice the son of hell that they are. So we have the disciples of the world (Pharasiees) vs the disciples of the spirit and of God. (Yeshua) You are free to choose which ever you want. As for why you do not have eyes to see and ears to hear. It is because you are a disciple of the world. Again this echoes the story of cain and Able. Caine was a disciple of the world and not only believed in God. But also made offerings to God. Able was a disciple of the spirit and of truth. Who also believed in God and made offerings to God. Yet one brothers offerings were rejected. Can you tell me why? Matthew 13:15 Turn to him before it is too late. am sorry to have bothered you IHS. |
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apatzer . . . Look, this maxim about God governing in the affairs of men is not, or should not be that difficult to figure out, you know? Here are two links which explore this subject. Sounds as if you would do well to familiarize yourself with what they have to say: www.bibletools.org www.beliefnet.com Your naivete in seeming to not understand how and what this means is testing my patience. Especially, as how you are always trying to incorporate Biblical standards into the political area. An arena where NOT EVERYBODY believes the way you do, yet you see so intent on trying to CRAM THIS DOWN MY THROAT. Why? Now, unless you address this issue directly EXPECT YOUR FUTURE POSTS TO BE IGNORED. |
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your very link you asked me to review testifies against you! As it says this....... You Will See This Only Once The Berean: Daily Verse and Comment The Bereans "received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so" (Acts 17:10-11). This daily newsletter provides a starting point for personal study, and gives valuable insight into the verses that make up the Word of God. See what over 145,000 subscribers are already receiving each day. Therefore the very link you give states they search the scriptures daily!!! Do you? do you cross reference scripture or do you lean on your own understanding? It is good that I test your patients! and your views that are refuted by scripture. If God did not care for you, he would let you die in your sin. but he did not! and gave you a way out , that is more than just fire insurance! as for patients and love. here is what it says.... 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 NIV Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. therefore brethren choose and be without excuse! |
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IRS Authority to Revoke Tax Exmpt Status grantspace.org |
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IRS Revokes Status www.philanthropy.com |
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IRS Properly Revokes Church Tax Status www.philanthropy.com |
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IHS) I am very dense my friend and have a lot to learn. Take this verse. John 4:24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth." 21“Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.” Do not let the word worship throw you off LS. It has been greatly misused by man. wor·ship [ˈwərSHəp] NOUN the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity. "the worship of God" · [more] synonyms: reverence · revering · worshipping · veneration · venerating · adoration · [more] VERB show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites. "the Maya built jungle pyramids to worship their gods" So when Galileo Galilei first peered at Jupiter , I could say A time is coming and has now come when man will view the planets. It is the Journey , Just think of how Galileo would feel if he could use our equipment today and review our data! he would be extactic! When science catches up and we can understand the other 97% of the Universe that we can not see and barley detect and we not only understand it but also can describe it in detail and know it. When we find the Math that has eluded us and can put it together with the math we now know. The fulfillment of that verse will have come to fruition. for reverence and adoration come with Truth and when the truth comes not only will science agree with it. Science will think they discovered it and revealed it to the world. Yet it was truly first reviled along the shores of the sea of Galilee. |
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INS |
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damestro . . . From the alternative news reporting sources which I regularly turn to I gather that the greatest reason for most of the unrest which may spill over to a larger and greater destructive and dangerous manifestation are due to the propaganda being broadcast through the MSM. As I noted in my first response to your inquiry America has been greatly influenced by Communistic/ Socialistic ideologies which are anathema to our Constitutional Republic. This influence has extended to the point of nearly completely monopolizing the journalism/ news which Americans now watch and listen to. With such power of influence Americans have not been given accurate assessment of the near complete takeover/ corruption by these Communists within our government. Such assessment as the unlawful campaign undermining which occurred in trying to derail Donald Trump’s presidential bid. Instead America has been subjected to cover-ups and lies which have led directly to the civil unrest to which you are referring. So, as the truth eventually comes out and the president begins to prosecute and bring to justice those who have compromised on their oaths to uphold American law, the American public will either “put on their big boy’s pants” and be thankful and grateful for a president who saved our Constitutional government or we will have to have Marshall law imposed. This is what I think about America’s civil unrest. |
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apatzer . . . Romans 14:1-6 14 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations. 2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs. (Or, one believeth that he may endorse or not endorse a political issue/ man (or woman), and one may believe that we should not endorse a political issue/ man (or woman). 3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him. 4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. 5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. 6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks. |
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IHS 1. I'm not on your back. 2. I am not your enemy. And last but not least. I have tried to have a healthy debate with you and we don't seem to be able to get past the very first point you made. You imeadiatly copy pasted a bunch of other points before the first point was even addressed. Also you will not like my response to your most recent comments and the verses that you have clearly taken out of context to fit your own narrative. Have you never read? 1 Corinthians 5:12 What business of mine is it to judge those outside the church? Are we not to Judge those inside? A good article... first5.org |
