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grege79
27-Jun-11, 15:11
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 Would you be a colonist?
I love this site. They do a good job of making this sound like an adventure!
It is a mars real estate firm (toungue in cheek for now, but a reality soon enough).
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It is an interesting idea to go to Mars and colonize there. Before we go to Mars we should think of colonizing the moon first because it is so close to earth. With the current technology it will take 6 months to go to Mars and will consume a lot of fuel plus cost. The problem with Mars and Moon is that they don't have good atmosphere with oxygen for the human or other living plants and animals to breathe. So, we have to live in a closed space like the international space station where we can survive for many months. But unlike the space station Mars and Moon have gravity but less than on earth. Both Mars and Moon have water. Water can be split into O2 and hydrogen. O2 can be used for breathing and H2 can be used as a rocket fuel. The American Apollo missions to moon already proven that we can go to the moon. The next step is to colonize and put a station on the moon. Sadly, most of the space programs and moon landings are not yet on the table because of our financial trouble but we can exploit the moon for some commercial value. For example, we can build solar panels on the moon and taransport back to big satellites orbiing the earth. The cheap and continuous supply of electricity generated from these solar panels can then be trasmitted to earth by microwaves. Since the moon has miniscule atmosphere and less gravity we can place satellites with solar panels much cheaper from the moon compared to putting up from earth. Thus we can solve our clean energy problen on earth.
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grege79
28-Jun-11, 17:56
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America is winding down it's space program, I hope China maintains the momentum. NASA are
letting 12000 staff go this year I believe.
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ubermensch43
28-Jun-11, 18:09
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Being or not being a colonist
Not a choice, I am afraid.... At the rate at which China, India, and the Muslim are procreating, it is a matter of time before the resources of this planet can no longer sustain a certain level of over-population. We will have to colonize or perish... eventually. So why not actively planning for it already... both in aggressively looking for planets that can sustain human life and working on spaceship that can propulse and accelerate infinitely much more than present capacities..... Sound too futuristic? Think futurist or eventually disappear, I am afraid.... there is not really a choice here.....
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grege79
28-Jun-11, 18:25
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I have to disagree on some of your points, China has a one child policy in urban areas, reduced
somewhat rurally. They have a large aging population and are addressing the issue. India may
currently have a large issue, but it should be looked at in terms of the sex ratio, it is massively
skewed in favor of males. As for Muslims, my parents were catholic and I am one of 7!
I see your point, however there are no population restriction laws anywhere, except China, so
none of these populations are breaking any rules. In fact the only nation addressing the issue
is one you point towards. I think criticism is a lot easier than solution, should nations be
population capped? If so, by land area? Food production?
I think technological advances will allow greater yields to be had, this will increase food
production. My concern is the future of fuels, if it comes from crops such as sugar cane, we will
uproot food production for energy production and watch populations starve.
Just a quick one regarding your username. I understand it was a term coined by Neitzsche, it
had been commandeered at times throughout history, but I know the term does stand alone.I
am curious as to your reasoning towards choosing it, ie I am hoping you are not pushing for a
eugenics agenda. I understand the logic, but most arguments around eugenics suffer from a
restricted view of what constitutes particular traits.
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ubermensch43
28-Jun-11, 21:04
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About my username and Nietzsche
I think I have read enough of Nietzsche, who happened to be my favorite philosopher, to be surprised at the Eugenic association between his name or his philosophy or the word ubermensch, for that matter. I have never encountered any type of eugenics either in " Thus spoke Zarathustra " or "Beyond Good and evil" or "Ecce Homo" or " The Anti-Christ " or " The Birth of Tragedy " or any of Nietzsche major or minor works. The philosophy of the Ubermensch, as far as I know and understand it, is a philosophy of personal transcendence, having nothing to do whatsoever with themes of racial transcendence. It is also a critique of traditional values based on other-world redemption schemes versus salvation based on this world and in this body. Nietzsche, throughout his life, was highly critical of both anti-antisemitism and German nationalism. That crazed lunatics like Hitler and the Nazis took his concept of personal transcendence and tried to extend it to a nation or a race have nothing to do neither with Nietzsche nor with his philosophy.I find it childish, and sometimes annoying, having to make this clarification over and over in the world where common men walk but surprised of having to do so even in a Science club of cyber chess... And my personal views of Eugenics have nothing whatsoever to do with neither with Nietzsche, the Ubermensch, nor his philosophy.
I was very aware that China was doing very-well in controlling its birth rate and what I was referring to studies pointing to a time (very futuristic indeed) where Planet Earth may not be able to sustain human life. But India's population growth is indeed unchecked by all means and so is the birth rate in Muslim nations ( there was a typo in my comments above: I meant Muslim world, the word world was omitted, my apologies).
Please let me know, if you have more concern about my username, or Nietzsche work and I hope that my avatar picture which is also of Nietzsche himself, will not cause any harm, neither in this club, nor in this website (although this is a Science club, not a philosophy club).
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grege79
29-Jun-11, 02:36
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All good, you responded perfectly. The idea espoused By the term is a worthy one, but I
wanted to ensure any misunderstandings were clarified so as to be better able to hold
discussions. No offense meant, but we get allsorts on the site
I agree though that the future of the race lies in space, an interesting point is that offworld
colonies would require population limitation, the mechanisms of which once considered may be
of aid to current population dilemmas. But how many would see that as a breach of their
rights? And how would we go about addressing this type of thinking?
I am a big believer in education, should we be focusing more on educational goals today in
order to address population concerns tomorrow?
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Colonialism has a bad name. In the 18th century, because of industraial revolution, western European nations became stronger than Asian, native Americans and African nations. So, British, Dutch, Germany, Spain etc. colonized the nations in those continents to get raw materials and then to sell their products. The people in the colonies became second class citizens and had to work for the colonizers. At one time British empire was one of the largest in the world. Since British colonies were all around the globe, the sun never set in British empire. In the recent movie Avatar, human beings try to colonize the new world and nearly ruin it due to greediness and to exploit or plunder the riches of the new world. So far, life forms do not exist in other planets and moons of the solar system. Even if it exists, it may be primitive life forms such as bacteria or viruses. We will not have much conflict and problem colonizing other planets and moons of our solar system but if there are something of commercial values in those planets such as gold or silver there can be a problem. People will rush and race to get there first. It is similar to what is happening in South China sea or in Arctic where it is estimated that there are billion barrels of oil and natural gas deposits awaiting to be claimed.
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grege79
01-Jul-11, 06:41
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The Arctic is going to be a very interesting place in the coming decade, I agree. Going to be
the source of much contention.
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