Chess Puzzle #10888

« TAP TO LOG IN

CHESS PUZZLE, FEN q7/2P1n2P/1p1P4/N2p4/QBpk4/1R1N1P2/5P2/R3K3 w Q -

Added by:	justmejoe
Added on:	07-May-09
Description:
Difficulty:	chess puzzle q7/2P1n2P/1p1P4/N2p4/QBpk4/1R1N1P2/5P2/R3K3 w Q -
Attempts:	879
Solved:	91 (10%)


White to move, mate in 2

Comments: (23) » Last

From

Comment

bogdan1709
28-Apr-13, 09:31

» Report abuse

easy

easy ......

elfuego51
28-Apr-13, 12:32

» Report abuse

Interesting....

I'm a little surprised this one only has a 9% success rate

rosbro
28-Apr-13, 12:46

» Report abuse

another solution?

Hi, why 0-0-0 and not simply Rd1 as I tried? Isn't it the same?
Thank you.

henderb
28-Apr-13, 12:48

» Report abuse

Difficulty here is because not all knows that white can castle. Lacks FEN info.

Again, FEN info is needed, in order to know any possibly castle and en-passant captures.
A chess position is not complete without all that info. That's why FEN standard exists!

luqq
28-Apr-13, 13:29

» Report abuse

Rd1 fails since there's no mate after 1 .. cxb3 (Rd1 was my almost first try as well), while after 0-0-0 there's Be1#

thestateimin
28-Apr-13, 13:49

» Report abuse

What idiot posted this one?

Being able to castle is not something that is foreseeable here.
Anyone who does not like to use the analyse button is screwed over.

pbednaruk
29-Apr-13, 04:00

» Report abuse

Would you like to see a big banner saying "YOU ARE ABLE TO CASTLE HERE" .

henderb
29-Apr-13, 08:50

» Report abuse

@pbednaruk: Position is incomplete without FEN info

In a real game you know all the encastlements that are possible, and the en-passant capture possibility (if any). So, all that info must be known in a puzzle, to consider it a complete position. Anything else is just a waste of time... is just NOT chess.... and we are here to practice chess.

pbednaruk
29-Apr-13, 12:44

» Report abuse

When you click on the king and see highlighted squares, you know if castling is available or not. So that you do have complete info.

thestateimin
05-May-13, 08:52

» Report abuse

Bollocks.

You don't know to click on the king to see that. In a real game you'd know if it's a possibility, in a real game I always think about if the opponent might castle until they can't.

This claim that clicking on the king makes it all okay presupposes that I'll see a reason to click on the king.

henderb
05-May-13, 17:16

» Report abuse

Agree with thestateimin

Touching pieces is not common in chess, at least you are going to move it. So, really the FEN information (just an string) is needed in the puzzles.

Gameknot should take care of it, and require to the puzzle creator to indicate all encastlement and en-passant captures possible.

Meanwhile, we can (as creators) indicate it in the description about the puzzle.

For those who need to refresh about FEN standard, please visit:

en.wikipedia.org

Best Wishes,
Henderb

pbednaruk
05-May-13, 22:05

Comment deleted on 05-May-13, 22:05

pbednaruk
05-May-13, 22:06

» Report abuse

Hey guys, this is internet chess. You can touch anything.

thestateimin
06-May-13, 16:03

» Report abuse

So, you're saying people should change how they play to accommodate idiotic and ill thought through chess puzzles, rather than thinking through the said chess puzzles?

Touch move being something that one needs to practise, and can't if we do things like you'd want us to (and yes, I am rolling my eyes at you).

henderb
06-May-13, 18:01

» Report abuse

Let's be calm, please

Hello. Please let's continue dialogs in a friendly direction.

Here we are concerned about that in order to solve puzzles like this one, is not fair to have hidden information, like all encastlements and en-passant captures possible.

And, i think is not fair, because in a real game you know all that information, but just the board and side to move is not enough.

As decribed in the wikipedia link: "The purpose of FEN is to provide all the necessary information to restart a game from a particular position."

So, a chess puzzle that doesn't indicate encastlements and enpassant captures, is not a "real chess position", but a deviation of it.

Best Wishes,
Henderb

felawinkelmolen
10-May-13, 06:02

» Report abuse

I think there are a few separated but correlated issues here.

1. the user should be able (obviously) to know if castling is valid or not. He can do so because he can click on the pieces to see it

2. the user has to know about this possibility, this might be the only real problem I can see here, although I would think that most users would get this after using the site for a little bit

3. the composer of the puzzle might not want to make it too obvious that the solution involves castling, this doesn't have to mean he wants to mislead the user into thinking castling is not a possible...

4. the puzzle should be like a situation of a real game:

4a. the important think is: in a real game it is easy to know if you can castle, the same is true here

4b. the only differences are aesthetic, in a real game you know you can castle by remembering the past moves, here you know it because you can click on the king; in a real game you cannot touch the pieces while here you can. Does it really matter? I think people are over reacting

thestateimin
10-May-13, 10:47

» Report abuse

No.

4a is incorrect. See my above comments.

felawinkelmolen
10-May-13, 11:51

Comment deleted on 10-May-13, 11:52

felawinkelmolen
10-May-13, 11:52

» Report abuse

4a states that it is easy to see if you can castle, I don't see how it is hard to click on the king, I don't know.. perhaps it's psychologically hard because you associate it with touching the real life piece..

thestateimin
10-May-13, 11:52

» Report abuse

You need to know to click on the king.
And you're presuming people don't think before clicking.

felawinkelmolen
10-May-13, 11:55

» Report abuse

yes that is why I wrote:

"the user has to know about this possibility, this might be the only real problem I can see here"

of course I do presume people think before clicking, they have to think "I wonder if I could castle" than they click on the king to know

thestateimin
10-May-13, 12:12

» Report abuse

Not if they're presuming fen protocols, which would be both justified and reasonable.

And you can't write that it's a problem and then say that it's not a problem.

It either is or it isn't.

So you saying it's not a problem is fine, but not if you're going to say that people can just click. That presupposes that they'd think to click and look.

fredkohn
15-Jul-21, 16:28

» Report abuse

Has this thread really existed for all these years without anyone pointing out that a solver should know White can castle? It is a well known puzzle convention that castling is assumed to be allowed, unless one can prove that it is not possible.

Account required

Please log in to post comments.